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Post by blackestofmages on May 5, 2013 14:22:32 GMT -5
which substitute? the fullbringer one only gets shikai abilities by trading in their fullbringer abilities, and the quincy gets the single extra one on each bow attribute because they have the least versatility of all the classes (6 abilities as opposed to the 9 of the fullbringer or the 19 of the shinigami) and because the quincy version gets less abilities to start of with than the fullbringer. the quincy gets the extra so they end up with around the same number of shikai as the fullbringer version (and if she makes the full trade the same number as a shinigami). same with the fullbringer - if they trade every ability they get the same number as a shinigami at a cost of their own unique abilities. On your proposed system, the problem of tying it into the zanpakuto abilities for free is that the shinigami would end up with the exact same amount of fullbring abilities as a fullbringer, as well as their own full amount of zanpakuto abilities and all the extras from the shinigami class - it would make the fullbringer flat out obselete. even if we did assume they had a gaining rate equal to the quincy, however, the trade off would still be much stronger in favour of this class, what with fullbring/quincy abilities being worth around 2 shikai abilities each (so it would be 1 + 1 + 2 for a total of 4, rather than the quincy's 3, or the fullbringer's equal trade) also, specialized only grants bonus abilities because it reduces versatility. as it wouldn't effect the versatility of fullbring abilities (what with them being untyped), it shouldn't grant extra fullbring abilities otherwise it's just free cake
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rater202
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Post by rater202 on May 5, 2013 15:00:26 GMT -5
they would get one at the first level of the class, and then one for every 2 they gain from level up After taking levels in My proposed class(name pending) so the only way you would be getting the same or higher as a pure Fullbringer is if you somehow take it at level one, which should be impossible, since I am going to do what I did For Esser and make it a level ten minimum, so some one taking it at level ten would at level twenty have 6 Fullbring abilities. if that is to much I could change it to 1 Fullbring ability for every other time the Shinigami gains abilities, so one at levels 13,17, and 19, leveling them with four abilities at level twenty, or I put a an upper limit and say that a shinigami with this class can't have more abilities than his level in said class, preventing people abusing it or I could do what Arrancar do for there shikai and tie the base number of abilities o your level when entering the class, than the rest would need to be gained by leveling in the class (maybe 1/4 base shikai abilities?)
I originally Tied it to shikai progression because the character is essentially using there Zanpakuto as there Fullbring Item, and since Fullbring is communicating with the spirit of an Item in order to bring out it's powers, I figured an Item that grew in power overtime would have a mean a fullbring that grew overtime. I understand if that doesn't work though.
If none of my suggestions above are workable, you may feel free to suggest one that is.
I was working from memory, and was in correct. but, the Fullbringer version can optionally gain two additional shikai abilities, twice through it's evolving blade class feature for a total of plus four. Plus there capstone gives there fullbring an alternate form which is pure Zanpakuto in nature. Finally the Fullbringer substitute can advance past level five, gaining a single shikai ability at level six and very level past that, an option the Quincies don't have (unless that's an oversight.)
Good point about Specialization though.
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Post by blackestofmages on May 5, 2013 15:24:59 GMT -5
fair enough, that would work . the previousl wording implied they where going to get them based on their zanpakuto abilities alone, which is what worried me. never mind what I said before then ;D true, but those extras from the evolving blade are obtained by taking prestige levels, not for free, which was my concern
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rater202
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Post by rater202 on May 5, 2013 15:30:31 GMT -5
That statement was more addressing your previous statement about FullSubs only gaining abilities through trade offs ;D
Still need an Idea for a name.
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Post by blackestofmages on May 5, 2013 15:35:10 GMT -5
I can't help you there XD still have no idea
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rater202
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Post by rater202 on May 5, 2013 15:46:31 GMT -5
Well, I am going to require the character to have the alive feat or otherwise posses shinigami abilities while being alive, so maybe Evolved Substitute?
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Post by blackestofmages on May 5, 2013 17:00:40 GMT -5
that'd work
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Post by blackestofmages on May 5, 2013 17:03:18 GMT -5
so,I do things around here, honestly. and since bount still have the lowest number of PrCs, I made them a present. and now one can recreate the only intresting bounto character, so I'm going back to ignoring them XD SirenPrerequisitesSkills: Perform (sing) 10+, Diplomacy 10+, Bluff 8+, sense motive 10+ Feats: Reiatsu Inspiration Save: base will 5+ hit dice: as base class level | Special | 1 | Siren Song, Wind Whispers, Enhanced Awareness | 2 | Voice of the Soul, Maestro's Melody | 3 | Slippery Mind, Banshee's Cry | 4 | Stageshow, Master Maestro's Melody | 5 | Songweaver, Unstoppable Voice |
Siren Song: The siren's greatest asset is her voice, enhanced beyond that of a normal being, her song is capable of speaking directly to the soul of those that hear it, distorting the mind and subtly altering the world itself. The Siren learns a number of songs, which become available so long as her siren level is high enough. As a standard action, the siren can begin any song she knows. Starting a song provokes an attack of opportunity. The Siren must make a perform (sing) check when she first uses beguiling song, which is used to determine the songs effects. The siren must concentrate to maintain this effect, and the effect persists so long as she continues to sing. Maintaining the song does not require an action, unless otherwise noted. The Siren can only maintain one song at one time. When the song stops, so do all of it's effects. Any song that targets a creature is hearing dependant. - Beguiling Song: The siren sings a beautiful melody that speaks to the mind of her targets, drawing them closer and putting them at peace. Requires Siren level 1, and costs 2 SEP. The siren attempts to use her voice to fascinate and draw in a victim. The check result is the save DC for each target to resist the effect. A creature that fails is fascinated, except that instead of sitting quietly on the ground, it must move towards the siren each round. One the creature is within 5ft of the siren, then it sits their and does nothing.
A creature that passes it's save or otherwise breaks out of the effect on it's own cannot be targeted again for the next 24 hours. The siren may target one creature per each siren level she possesses when using this ability. She may target any creature she knows the location of (see wind whispers).
- Symphony of Silence: Requires Siren Level 1, and costs 4 SEP. The Siren creates a tune that perfectly drowns out all other noise within range. Every creature within 20ft + 5ft per siren level of the siren is silenced.
Unwilling creatures are entitled to a will save, with the perform result as the save DC, to resist the silence effect. A creature that passes it's save is immune to the song so long the siren maintains it. If she starts the song again, the creature must pass a second will save to resist.
- Song of Bravery Requires Siren Level 2, and costs 5 SEP. Whilst the siren maintains the song, all friendly creatures within hearing range gain a morale bonus equal to ¼ her character level on all roll to hit and damage, and all rolls to resist any Mind-Affecting abilities.
- Cacophony of Confusion: Requires Siren Level 2, and costs 6 SEP. All creatures within 20 ft of the siren + 5ft per siren level are confused. Each victim is entitled to a will save, with a DC equal to the result of the perform test, to resist the effect, and a further will save each round they are confused. A creature that passes it's save is immune to the song so long the siren maintains it. If she starts the song again, the creature must pass a second will save to resist.
The Siren may choose to exclude any creature in the bubble from the effect.
- Fortissimo of Fear: Requires Siren Level 3, and costs 6 SEP. All creatures within 20 ft of the siren + 5ft per siren level are frightened for 1d4 rounds. Each victim is entitled to a will save, with a DC equal to the result of the perform test, to resist the effect. If the victim passes, they are shaken whilst the siren maintains the song.
Once a creature has passed the will save against the frightened effect, they do not need to test for the save again for another 24 hours. The shaken effect still takes effect, however. The Siren may choose to exclude any creature in the bubble from the effect.
- Spellbreaker Song: Requires Siren Level 3. The each round the Siren may, as a standard action, target a single creature or spiritual effect within 100ft, and pay SEP equal to 1 + the creation cost (for items) or a single continuous spiritual effect on the target. Then, the Siren makes a perform test opposed by a character level test for the target/creator – if the Siren wins, the effect ends. This cannot target shikai, bankai, fullbring, quincy bow, complete holy form etc.
- Aria of Illusion: Requires Siren Level 3. The siren may use either silent image (1 SEP), minor image (3 SEP) or major image (7 SEP) with the save DC equal to the result of the perform check. The image persists so long as the Siren maintains the song.
- Serenade of Silhouettes Requires Siren level 3, and costs 3 SEP. The Siren benefits from mirror image against any creature within hearing range. Creatures that cannot hear her song perceive her normally.
- Dirge of Depression: Requires Siren Level 4, and costs 4 SEP. Whilst the siren maintains the song, all non-friendly creatures within hearing range gain a morale penalty equal to ¼ her character level on all roll to hit and damage, and all rolls to resist any Mind-Affecting abilities.
- Flickering Caprice
- Requires Siren level 4, and costs 5 SEP per target. The Siren targets any number of creatures she knows the location of. The target benefits from full concealment so long as the creature targeting them is within hearing range of the Siren.
- Irresistable Dance Requires siren level 5, and costs 12 SEP. the siren targets a single creature within hearing range, and the victim is forced to dance so long as the Siren maintains the song. The victim is entitled to a will save, with a DC equal to the result of the perform test, or be forced to dance. The victim is unable to take any action, and suffers –4 penalty to AC and a –10 penalty on Reflex saves. The dancing victim provokes attacks of opportunity each round on its turn.
- The Nameless Song: The Siren hums a slow, haunting melody that empowers and restores the vitality and power of the Siren's allies. Requires siren level 5, and costs 10 SEP per round maintained. Each target gains fast healing equal to ½ the perform result, and benefits from Haste. Maintaining The Nameless Song requires a standard action each round.
The siren may target one creature per each siren level she possesses when using this ability. She may target any creature she knows the location of (see wind whispers). She cannot target herself. Enhanced Awareness: The Siren have a greater ability than most to detect spiritual power, allowing them to detect the perfect prey before luring them into their net. The Siren doubles the range of any attempt to sense reiatsu, and detects whether a creature in range has spiritual power regardless of the result (though they will read as level 1). Wind Whispers: The bounto is able to, as a swift action, communicate verbally with any creature she knows the location of. The target can hear her voice, but she herself cannot hear any responses. Alternatively, by spending 10 minutes within a close distance of a willing creature, she can create a link that allows the two of them to communicate verbally regardless of the distance between the two of them. This does not reveal the location of the other if they are split up. Voice of the Soul: The siren is capable of communicating with any creature, regardless of language. She understands every spoken language and everything she says is understood by those in hearing range. This does not effect written words, or recordings, only spoken word by living creatures. Slippery Mind: Sirens' skills are focused on manipulating the mind of the others, and they themselves become much more resistant. From 3rd level onwards, the siren gains the slippery mind feat, even if she does not meet the prerequisites. Maestro's Melody: As a standard action that costs 5 SEP, the Siren may give a suggestion (as the spell) to a single creature effected by one her Siren Songs. The victim is entitled to a will save to resist, with a save DC of 10 + ½ character level + reiatsu modifier. This does not break her concentration, or interfere with Siren Song at all, though if the suggestion works the target is no longer effected by the song. Banshee's Cry: The siren gains the ability to let loose a scream that deafens and disorientates those around her, and that saps away a targets soul. As a standard action that costs 6 SEP, the Siren may let loose a banshee's cry. This is either a cone shaped burst with a length of 30ft, or a burst cented on herself with a radius of 20ft. Any creature in the burst, other than the siren and her doll, must pass a will save or be dazed for 1d4 rounds. This is a hearing dependant ability. The siren must be able to speak to use this ability. Any creature effected is also deafened for a number of rounds equal to the bounto's character level. When using this ability, the bounto may also choose to spend extra SEP, and for each 3 extra spent each victim also suffers 1d4 damage to their reiatsu attribute, halved if they pass their save. Stageshow: When the siren sings her song, she is able to also manipulate her spiritual power to create a dazzling array around herself. When the Siren starts any Siren Song, she may pay 4 SEP to activate this ability as part of the same action. If she does so, any creature looking at her must pass a will save or be dazed for 1 round, and then blinded for a number of rounds equal to her siren level. Each subsequent round she maintains her song, any creature in a square the siren threatens must pass a will save or be blinded for 1 round. Master Maestro's Melody: As a standard action that costs 15 SEP, the Siren may give a suggestion (as the spell) to all creatures effected by one her Siren Songs. The victim(s) are entitled to a will save to resist, with a save DC of 10 + ½ character level + reiatsu modifier. This does not break her concentration, or interfere with Siren Song at all, though if the suggestion works the target is no longer effected by the song. Songweaver: As the siren perfects her art, using her voice to create a symphony of power. The siren is able to use two siren songs at once. Both songs use the same perform roll. The Siren may also stop one of the songs and begin a different song, using the same roll as the original. Unstoppable Voice: The Siren is immune to any deafening or silence effects. sorry about the crappy wording at times. I'm worried about tying the save effect into a perform roll, but it seemed flavourful so, thoughts/feelings/critisisms?
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rater202
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Post by rater202 on May 5, 2013 17:22:13 GMT -5
So a bard? that works.
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Post by rater202 on May 5, 2013 18:36:21 GMT -5
Has the team considered epic Prestige Classes yet? there are something's from the Manga that I doubt could be replicated without them, like the royal guard, who are individually supposed to be more powerful than the entire Gotei 13, Butterflaizen, whatever the hell Ichigo is*
Even the Head captain has powers that I could swear came from an epic class, what with summoning ten trillion skeletons and all
*Let's not replicate that one, it would get The player branded a sue so fast
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Post by blackestofmages on May 5, 2013 18:36:22 GMT -5
sort of a bard. more focused on debuffs than the regular buffness XD
but yes, a fair few of the abilities are bard-inspired
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Post by rater202 on May 5, 2013 21:52:32 GMT -5
Okay, Here is My Evolved Substitute, constructive criticism is appreciated Evolved Substitute It is said that a Substitute Shinigami and a Fullbringer can free share their powers. This happens for various reason, such as to seal an alliance or because one party hates their powers and wishes to be rid of them. when a substitute gives their power to a fullbringer, said fullbringer Himself becomes a substitute; but when the substitute receives power from the fullbringer, the substitutes power begins to transcend that of a Shinigami. Rarely someone with a dormant Fullbring will become a substitute, when this happens and the substitute later awakes their hereditary power, the effect is nearly Identical. PrerequisitesLevel: Must be level 10 or higher when you take this class Class Features: Must have a Zanpakuto Feats: Alive, Living Shinigami or Special: have levels in a prestige class that grants a Zanpakuto to a living human Feats: Spiritual tradition(Fullbringer) or Special: must have had a Fullbringer transfer their powers to you Special: if you qualify for this class by having a Fullbringer's powers transferred to you, you must pick abilities that are at least somewhat similar to the one who gave you their powers. consult your GM Special: Must not already be a Fullbringer Hit Dice: D10 or Base Still suck at tables 1. Evolved Zanpakuto: Your Zanpakuto becomes the focus of your newly developed fullbring. you gain a single fullbring ability. every time you gain 2 Zanpakuto abilities from base class levels, after you gain your first level in this class, you gain an additional Fullbring ability. these abilities are available whenever you have access to shikai abilities not granted by feats. Your Zanpakuto counts as a fullbring weapon for all intents and purposes. 1. Fullbringing: As the Fullbringer class feature. 1. Evolved Reitsu: Your spiritual energy is beginning to transcend the potential it had before. If you were a Warrior shinigami you add your Evolved Substitute level to your Zanpakuto damage rolls, if you were an expert Shinigami you gain it as a dodge bonus, and if were a Kido Shinigami you add it as a bonus to all Kido rolls, other than to hit. 2. Perfect Communication: Being able to commune with the spirits of inanimate objects has given you great insight on how to best Speak with the soul of the sword that serves as the avatar of your power. You gain Soul Companion as a Bonus Feat, if you already posses Soul companion you may select Expanded Fullbring or One Zanpakuto Feat for which you qualify to take in its place. 2.Improved Air walking: By merging your Shinigami Reiatsu With the power of your Fullbring, you can improve your air walking abilities. You may walk on water or balance on are While in your Physical body, in a spiritual plane, or both. Doing one of those actions increases the DC of the balance Check by 5. Doing both increases the DC by 10. 3. Evolved Bankai: From now on, when you enter Bankai, or an equivalent ability, all Fullbring abilities you possess through class features are considered to be in their evolved state. 3. Constant release: your connection to the spirit of your power has allowed you to transcend the normal limits of the Initial release. You gain constant release as a bonus feat. If you already posses constant release, or for some reason do not have a proper shikai, than you instead gain either expanded fullbring or a single Zanpakuto feat that you qualify for. 4. Transcendental Perception: Your hybridized powers allow you to sense Reitsu much better than either of your component powers. You add your Evolved Substitute levels as a bonus to all sense motive checks to sense Reitsu. In addition, you may spend a full round action focusing on a specific Reitsu signature to gain the ability to track said signature as though you had the scent ability. like a hollow his ability is not tied to actual scent. You may only track one Reitsu signature at a time and can only hold a “scent” for 24 hours. 5. Transcendental Release: this ability has two aspects. first, the Evolved Substitute ads half again to the duration of His Bankai, applying before all other abilities that extend it. If for some reason the Evolves Substitute does not posses Bankai or an equivalent with a time limit than this half of the ability has no effect. Second, and more Importantly, The Evolved Substitute Gains one Bankai ability, two Four Shikai abilities that are not doubled in bankai, and two Fullbring abilities that do not evolve. In addition, the The Evolved substitute may select a single fullbring ability the posses. They may use this ability, even when separated from their Zanpakuto while in possession of their blade the ability is always considered to be Evolved, and when in bankai or it’s equivalent it is considered to be in it’s ultimate evolution. Alright that about Sums it up. I reserve the Right to swap Constant Release and Transcendental Senses, And I am A bit worried that I went Overboard on the capstone. I specifically wrote it so that one only needed to be a living human with Shinigami power, rather than a living Shinigami, because I figured If the Player can give a justified reason for why they have multiple kinds of power, they should be allowed to go for it. If that Doesn't seem like a good Idea I can rewrite it to be a Pure Shini only deal, but that will take a week cause finals are this Week.
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Post by blackestofmages on May 5, 2013 23:50:06 GMT -5
question: what levels are these obtained at? because right now it's hard to judge the PrC
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Post by blackestofmages on May 5, 2013 23:52:42 GMT -5
also, I'm somewhat worried you went overboard on trancendal release much like you if it's a level 10 capstone then... no, even then. especially since it gains the fullbringers' capstone as well, which is what worries me the most - only the fullbringer should ever get the perfect evolution.
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rater202
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Post by rater202 on May 6, 2013 8:04:32 GMT -5
Okay, I will change that, and maybe cut out the time extension as well and see if that helps. wright now it's a five level with an option to advance past the capstone, but I haven't figured out what benefit that would have yet. If you think a level ten would work better I can make it one, but like I said last night it will have to wait about a week. also I will need a some filler abilities.
Just so everything is clear, If I were to Change the capstone to 1 Bankai, four Shikai, and two Fullbring, and allow one fullbring to be evolved indefinitely. as opposed to the current Version that also increases time, and grants a ultimate evolution.
Would you be opposed to someone with levels in this class gaining access to Ultimate Evolution through , a second prestige class, sortof like the vizard unleasesd, were you gain acces to grator power by assuming a short lived and hard to control form. (in this ase, using fullbring to overcome the normal limits of bankai.) If Evolved Substitute is reworked as a level ten, this class would be epic, requiring max levels in Evolved Substitute to take.
Edit: I went back and Put the levels of the abilities in
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